In this interview, Daniel Wild appeared on Paul Murray Live – Sky News Australia to discuss the IPA’s research into Net Zero.
All media posted onto the IPA website are directly related to the promotion and dissemination of IPA research.
Below is a trancript of the interview.
Paul Murray:
Thank you so much for watching. Let us get straight into it right now. No sooks, no lefties, Sunday. Hey, a reminder that there’s going to be a great documentary. 50 years, can you believe it, next week? 50 years since the dismissal. November 11, we all remember what happened. For those who of course don’t remember the details, there’s all of this stuff beforehand. Like when Sir Joe changed the political affiliation of one of the senators. It’s fascinating story told by our dear friend, Chris Uhlmann, you’ll see it here on the 11th. Till then, no sooks, no lefties, and joining me in the big screen right now from all beautiful parts of Australia like Tasmania, like Adelaide, are our mates as always on a Sunday night, the wonderful and delightful Lee Hanson, of course kicking for One Nation, which is surging in the polls yet again, buddy and Daniel Wild from the Institute of Public Affairs, among other things, big supporters of Tony Abbott and his history of Australia.
So, so, so. Daniel, I’m going to start with you. Nats, make the decision, which will have no doubt been cheered on by your good self, which was, that’s it. Gone with net-zero. Very importantly though, and this is part of the calculation, is climate change is still a thing and we need to do something about it, but we shouldn’t be running at the same pace as places like where the UN wants us to go. Important nuance that will no doubt be lost in the next couple of days. But let’s be simple. If the Libs don’t match this, then the coalition is going to break and will break until the next election. And I’ll be honest, talking to lots of people in the Nats, they’re happy with the three-way contests and Lee would be very happy for that too. But your thoughts, mate.
Daniel Wild:
Well, I think this is a very important development. Don’t underestimate this. We’ve now broken the back of net-zero and net-zero is now a dead man walking. We’re not going to get rid of it overnight. It’ll require change of government to do that, but we now have a contest and net-zero is such a bad policy that it will not withstand a political contest, just like the voice to Parliament. As soon as that was exposed to the public, as soon as there was a debate, support for it fell off a cliff. And that’s what’s going to happen to net-zero. And it’s got to be said, the usual suspects in the media are going to derive this as climate denies and a fringe issue and this radical conservative base. But this is a mainstream issue.
And what the nationals and I think the Liberal party is going to follow very soon, by the way. What now needs to happen is they need to communicate this to the public. They need to explain to the public why net-zero is the number one cause of their energy bills going up. And if they’re able to achieve that, the coalition will start going up in the polls again. And it’s also got to be said, people like Senator Matt Canavan, a good friend of your shows, he was derided as someone who just was blowing in the wind, banging on about this issue. Well guess what happens when you provide leadership? You are able to shape the political system. So don’t underestimate how significant this is. This is the beginning of the end of net-zero and good riddance I say.
Paul Murray:
Lee, again, one of the reasons why One Nation has surged in the way that you have is absolute clarity on issues like this, right? There’s no doubt where One Nation sits. What do you think about where the Nats are going and how much of that is about freaking out about what you can do to seats in the bush?
Lee Hanson:
Look, first of all, it’s great to see that common sense is starting to prevail, right? So well done. However, let’s be really honest here. The only reason why it’s happening is because One Nation is leading the way and has put them in this position because voters and people are moving across to One Nation because we have been standing our ground and everybody knows scrap net-zero and what it stands for. So yes, it is a good start.
However, I have my concerns. Pardon me. I have my concerns. Great. Get rid of net-zero by 2050 target says the Nationals, but still want to achieve the emissions. The question’s going to be in the detail. How? How are they going to? What does their plan look like? And this week coming up into the floor of Parliament will be key. Will they be supporting or opposing the ridiculous solar and wind farms that are covering Australia and yet still coming? And foreign invested most of them as well. Will they be standing up for farmers, which is meant to be their predominant voter demographic and fighting? Tomago Smelters another one which is crushing because the net-zero targets. So proof will be in pudding this week to see if the Nats actually stand up, whether it’s just lip service or they’re really going to commit to it.
Paul Murray:
I know I put a lot of pressure on you guys when I ask questions like this, but I am going to sit here. We all know where I’m coming from. You all know how I vote, you all know how I believe, but occasionally there is a need for a little bit of devil’s advocate here. Right. According to the opinion polls, the left has grown since the election and they had a mega win at the election, right? What was 55, 45 is now 57, 43. Okay. Now great, there’s been a massive reorganisation and what’s happening on the right? All to the benefit of One Nation. Yay, I’m in. All right, happy, happy, happy. All right. But Daniel, this is part of what’s, there’s no sense of buyers remorse about what they did in May. Is that about the opposition or is that about the government?
Daniel Wild:
Yeah, it’s a fair point Paul. I’ve got a couple of observations. I mean, firstly, obviously labour wanted a landslide, but there was not a lot of enthusiasm for labour. It was a vote against Peter Dutton and the Liberal party. And I can tell you that as a candidate, people weren’t running hand over fist saying, yeah, Anthony Albanese is going to save Australia. It was a reluctant defensive vote mostly for labour against Peter Dutton and the Liberal party because labour ran such an effective he cuts you pay campaign that penetrated particularly in the outer suburbs. The other point that I would make is the Liberal party adopted, don’t forget the Liberal party adopted net-zero for the purpose of defending the Teal seats, right? Josh Frydenberg wanted to keep his seat and the other Teal candidates. Well they lost, right?
So it is not a vote winner for the Liberal party. I keep on saying this, it is not popular. People know whether you’re being authentic or not authentic, and the reality is that this is a vote loser for the Liberal party. So look, I think this is a move that will gain public support. Again, if it is argued for. You must make the case. That’s the critical point here.
Paul Murray:
All right, Lee, let’s talk about One Nation and its growth particularly in Tasmania. Now, again, it’s all well and good for you to be the superstar that you are, to be the candidate, to be as available to programmes like this, which means the world to us. I think you’ve got a mega future in front of you. If you ever need somebody to pump your tyres, just give me a call, okay? Always here to pump your tyres. Okay. But obviously you need an organisation behind it and you’re starting to get it. And that also means members, because these are the people who can go and knock on a door for the 17 weeks of early voting, actually stand there, be it in the sun or be it in the rain. Tell me about One Nation and what you’re starting to now build in Tasmania.
Lee Hanson:
We have seen tremendous growth and support for One Nation, not only nationally with 100% increase in membership since the election. But specifically if I just look at Tasmania, I actually launched our first branch in Tasmania a couple of weeks ago up in Bass, which is Launceston region. And the turnout was phenomenal. It was amazing. The whole purpose of the branch, as you say, is to help ensure we identify the right candidates and get them elected through volunteers and support, but it’s also to give them a voice. It’s to ensure we understand what the real issues are. And we had that conversation at the Bass launch and there were no surprises. The real issues which One Nation is speaking up about, hence why the support is growing, is mass immigration, is net-zero, is education, is cost of living, is housing, it never ends. And people are desperate.
They’re seeking for strong leadership and party representation. So I’ve launched the first one of four more branches to come. So that’ll be five in Tasmania and every electorate, which is fantastic. So the next one is on the 15th of November in the seat of lines, but also with that already I’ve seen over 300% growth in Tasmanian One Nation membership since the election. So it’s phenomenal. But I have one challenge, which I’m not sure if you’re aware of, Paul. I’m currently trying to get the party registered in Tasmania, but I have this ridiculous hurdle I have to overcome. In order to register a political party in Tasmania where the only state or territory which require a certain number of your membership base to publish their names and electorate address, so what’s on the electoral role, in all the newspapers in Tasmania. Now you tell me, is that a breach of privacy laws?
Paul Murray:
So Billy blogs of Smith Street has to say, not only here’s my politics, they have to put it in the freaking paper.
Lee Hanson:
Correct. So we’re the only state and territory-
Paul Murray:
Wow.
Lee Hanson:
In Australia that requires this, which is absolutely ridiculous. And the only way we can get this changed is through the floor of Parliament, state Parliament, Tasmania. Now as if they’re going to allow One Nation change the law so One Nation can get registered easy, but we’re not letting it overcome us. It is ridiculous. It is chaotic and it needs to be changed, but the support is there. So we’re getting our stat decks and don’t you worry, it won’t be long before we’re registered and we’ll be putting candidates in the state election and the council election. So here we come.
Paul Murray:
Yeah, let’s see. Let’s see. All right. Well look, it is a minority government only held together with sort of twine and wire, so we’ll see what happens. Again, fairly lefty ones and they’re not going to be that great to One Nation, but good point. Thank you guys. Do appreciate it. We’ll see you again next week. No sooks. No lefties. Good chat this Sunday night. Let’s…
This transcript from Daniel Wild on Paul Murray Live – Sky News Australia from 2 November 2024 has been edited for clarity.
