Rita Panahi:
Joining me now is the Institute of Public Affairs Chief Economist, Adam Creighton, and former Liberal MP Nicolle Flint. Nicolle, I’ll start with you. The Australian Defence Force currently has 61,000 members. It wants to have 80,000 members by 2040. I don’t think that’s likely under the current circumstances, do you?
Nicolle Flint:
I don’t think it’s likely, Rita. Why would you join the Australian Defence Force and risk your life and your reputation and your family, knowing what has just happened to Ben Roberts-Smith, one of our most decorated soldiers? Why would you sign up when you know that your superiors probably won’t be held to account for alleged cultural issues or issues and things that may have happened on the battlefield? Why would you sign up to endure a decade of allegations hanging over you and then have the full force of the federal government departments and sections of the mainstream media pursuing you, Rita? It is completely unfair.
And I just can’t see how people can have confidence in joining our defence force right now under these circumstances, particularly after you look at the manner in which Ben Roberts-Smith was arrested, which I think would make Russia and Chinese communists really happy. He was arrested in front of his family. He was arrested in public at an airport. The media were there. How they were granted access like they were is beyond belief. The AFP have a lot to answer for, but of course, the AFP aren’t answering any questions, Rita. This is an absolutely shocking situation. And at a time when we have record-low recruitment in defence, it is just a disaster.
Rita Panahi:
On the arrest, Adam, the AFP really need to account for how certain members of the media seem to be forewarned of this arrest. They seem to be right there with their cameras trained so they could capture the event. It’s like a humiliation ritual.
Adam Creighton:
Yeah, look, and he’s already been humiliated quite well enough, I would say, in previous years. Look, it doesn’t surprise me. There’s leaks from the AFP, like there are in any police forces. It’s a bad thing. And of course it’s designed to add to the humiliation, as you say. Look, the only things that I would add to Nicolle’s comments there, which I completely agree with, is that these events are based on 2009, I think it’s 2012 or something. Shouldn’t there be some sort of statute of limitations with these charges? I mean, how can you have so many years later, these charges brought against you? I mean, of course, you would not join. As a young man or woman, you would not join the force thinking that even after you leave and even if you win the Victoria Cross, you can still be charged with murder 14, 15 years later. It’s crazy.
Rita Panahi:
Well, Hugh Poate, the father of fallen Australian soldier, Private Robert Poate, has questioned why a dedicated team of investigators has spent six years building a case against Ben Roberts-Smith while his son killer remains free. Robert was one of three Australians killed in Afghanistan by rogue Afghan soldier known as Hekmatullah while they were playing cards. This happened at a base in 2012. Hugh told The Daily Telegraph, “They’ve spent 10 years and hundreds of millions, determined to find enough evidence to arrest Ben for allegedly murdering three Afghans, but successive governments have taken no action at all to capture Hekmatullah and those who proudly confessed in the Afghan Supreme Court to murdering three Australian soldiers. My son was one of them.” Nicolle, this is just a heartbreaking case, and you can understand that father’s grief. Why hasn’t more been done to bring some justice to this rogue Afghan soldier and anyone else who assisted him?
Nicolle Flint:
Well, precisely, and I think that this is the very question that should be put to every single defence minister who has served in that portfolio since this incident and our involvement in the Afghan War. I would love to hear their answers, and I would also love to hear the answers from the AFP, from the Department of Defence, and any other bureaucrats that have been involved in this entire reprehensible process involving our SAS troops, and particularly Ben Roberts-Smith. And I’m guessing, Rita, that one of the answers as to why they haven’t pursued Afghans who murdered Australian troops is because that would be quite difficult. They would have to leave the safety of Australia. They would have to go to a terrorist-controlled country. They would have to put their lives at risk. And I sincerely doubt we will see that happen. Now, I’d love to be proven wrong. So please, if you’re a bureaucrat out there who has actually done the right thing and tried to bring justice for an Australian soldier who gave his life for our nation, I would love to hear about it.
Rita Panahi:
Now, Adam, the war memorial in Canberra has confirmed it won’t take down its display of Ben Roberts-Smith while he’s facing these charges. Is that the right decision?
Adam Creighton:
Yeah, look, I think it certainly is. There’s something in this country called the presumption of innocence, and he is certainly innocent until proven otherwise in a court of law. We often forget that, I think. People are charged with things, and then it’s basically treated like they’ve actually done it. It just goes back to my earlier point. I mean, it’s been so long since these events. The charges are still being brought. And could I just stress, the decision to charge someone is a real… It’s almost a political decision when you have limited resources in the AFP, in the Commonwealth Department of Prosecutions, et cetera. So I just don’t understand from a pragmatic point of view, solely pragmatic point of view, why would you choose to target someone like this when it’s going to have all of this collateral damage on the hiring for the forces, et cetera?
Rita Panahi:
And more so than that, do they really have a hope of conviction? Because that’s another decision you make when you bring charges. Is there a reasonable chance that you’re going to achieve a conviction in a case?
Adam Creighton:
Well, from what I’ve read, no. It’s not very high at all. I hope he has some of the best lawyers in the country on his side. And to prove something beyond reasonable doubt that occurred in 2010, I think it’s going to be extremely difficult.
Rita Panahi:
In a foreign country.
Adam Creighton:
In a foreign country.
Rita Panahi:
But the AFP would say there’s a number of witnesses and there’s people who’ve given evidence. So we will leave that to the courts. Now, let’s move on to Labor’s proposal to overhaul tax settings for property investors. Well, that could drive a 30% spike in rents over the next two years. That’s according to a major real estate boss, Nathan Birch. The head of property management firm, Blink, told realestate.com.au, “These changes will scare a lot of investors into selling. It’s poor timing, it would be a massive shock to the market, and the average tenant would struggle.” Nicolle, Jim Chalmers, I’ve got to say, the treasurer, I wonder whether he is economically illiterate. He’s hinted that there’s going to be changes to the capital gains tax discount and negative gearing provisions. Are they just clueless about the full effects of a change like this, or are they so ideologically driven that they don’t care? They’re just so embroiled in the politics of envy and the haves and have-nots. And despite the fact that most property investors are mom and dad investors trying to secure their financial future, they’re going after that sector.
Nicolle Flint:
Last time I checked, the main group of property investors were nurses, teachers, police who had one or two investment properties at most, Rita. So yep, they’re going after mom and dad investors again. What really irks me about this, though, not even irks me, disgusts me, is that Prime Minister Anthony Albanese said during the federal election campaign, “There will be no changes to capital gains tax.” So once again, we are seeing Labour lying. We are seeing Labour remove confidence from the sector, and we are seeing Labour tax people more. This is what they always do. They lied when they said that they wouldn’t during the previous election campaign. And here they are, not even 12 months in, and going to change the rules once again and remove confidence from our property market.
Rita Panahi:
Adam, Nicolle makes an excellent point thereabout. We just had an election not too long ago. This wasn’t on the agenda. They don’t have a mandate to make these sort of changes. The last time they took this sort of issue to an election, they lost. They lost the unlosable election, and now they’re talking about it because there’s a fuel crisis, there’s a budget crisis. They’re not going to waste this crisis, are they?
Adam Creighton:
No, certainly not. Look, you said that they’re ideologically driven. I don’t even give them that much credit. This is all about politics, basically. It’s about making a change that will not actually have much impact, in my view. They’re going to twiddle with, they’re going to tweak the 50% discount. It’s not going to raise any money. People are just less likely to sell in that case. They’re just going to hold it on forever, basically pass it on to their kids. All the studies in the world basically show, even from Grattan show that a small change will only have a 1 or 2% effect on prices at most, and even then over quite a long period of time.
So this is just to be seen to be doing something. But the irony of that is it’s going to actually hurt younger people the most, and the government’s banging on all the time about intergenerational equity. Well, presumably, and almost certainly, it’s going to be grandfathered. So anyone who’s already bought is going to be fine, still on the 50% rate, but anyone new will be on, say, 33% discount or 25% discount, so they won’t go in. So basically, the younger people are going to be hurt, and all of the so-called evil boomers and the Gen Xers or whatever, they’re going to be fine with their 50% discount. You’ll be okay, Rita.
Rita Panahi:
Fantastic. That’s all I care about. Adam Creighton and Nicolle Flint, thanks for your time tonight.
Adam Creighton:
Thanks Rita.
This transcript of Adam Creighton on The Rita Panahi Show Sky News Australia from 9 April 2026 has been edited for clarity.
