In this interview Daniel Wild appeared on Paul Murray Live – Sky News Australia to discuss the IPA’s research on Australia’s political realignment.
All media appearances posted onto the IPA website are directly related to the promotion and dissemination of IPA research.
Below is a transcript of the interview.
Paul Murray:
Thank you so much for watching. Let us not muck around, let’s get to it right now. She’s where we will be next week, and I believe she’ll be with us when we are there next week. Lovely Lee Hanson is joining us right now in lovely Hobart, as winter is sort of hanging on forever. And Daniel Wild from the IPA joins us now from beautiful Adelaide, where I’m imagining everything is awesome. All right. So, Lee, what about this post-election surge for One Nation? An incredible support at the election, which meant, of course, there was three Senators, they’re guaranteed for the next six years, mum up again in three years, fingers crossed your good self when it comes to Tasmania, but the numbers for the party is you’re up three points in the first poll post-election that’s done by the Channel 9 newspapers. Why do you think there’s a bump right now?
Lee Hanson:
Hi Paul, people are starting to realise and wake up to what’s going on. They’re feeling the pain and the pressure created by this current government. The cost of living, immigration, this work ideology in schools, in our education, there are so many issues that are really coming to the surface right now. The support for One Nation is growing, people are realising that One Nation is the real conservative party and the real opposition, and the way forward here. So, yes, we have seen it, we are hearing it through social media, through emails, through people reaching out, the support and the contact for help is overwhelming, and it really is evident of the crisis and the situation, time for need, we are here. And One Nation’s here, we are listening, we’re speaking for them, and that’s why we’re seeing the polls increase, and I believe we will continue to do so for some time to come until people do all realise that we are the true opposition.
Paul Murray:
No, look, I agree. Daniel, I think it comes then always to clarity of message, right? What Pauline has done her entire career, what Lee’s just shown then, what our new senators candidates, and of course, James does with us each and every week. Clarity of message, all right. Now again, I’m not pretending that this jump is a jump to 50% in the polls, but still, it is sizeable, it is important, because again, while some of that sort of third that decided with their preferences which way to go, seemingly coalesce around labour, it really matters and it is a lesson of the Libs about clarity of message, whatever the message is that’s for them to decide, but clarity of message.
Daniel Wild:
Well, exactly right, it’s clarity of message, but more fundamentally it’s actually standing up for something, that’s the first condition to get people to get behind you. How can someone support you if you yourself don’t know what you believe in? And so, people will say all kinds of different things about Senator Hanson, but one thing is clear that she stands up for things, and she says things, and she’s been doing it for 30-odd years now. So, Australians will support that. And what happened at the federal election was the Coalition couldn’t communicate to the Australian people what it was that they were going to do when they were in government, because they fundamentally didn’t have a set of values or clear policies to take to the election. And I could also tell you that there wasn’t much enthusiasm for Labour either, it was a very defensive victory for Labour, a lot of voters were scared of what a Peter Dutton government might do, and so voted in a negative fashion toward Labour. So, I think if you stand up for something, and as you say, articulate it clearly, Australians will get behind you.
Paul Murray:
I’m also a great believer in sometimes you’ve got to learn, not just learn the lessons, but also learn the lessons from those that you may detest, right? Which is the way that they work is when they win, they say, we’ve won forever, there’s been a revolution. When they lose, we’ll get you next time. All right. So, I’m going to stick with the we’ll get you next time thing. And also, I want to have a conversation about yet another totally unnecessary clash between demonstrators and police, yet again in Melbourne. Now, apparently there were just 40 people, and I know nothing more than that number, 40 people that were involved in the latest version of the Let Women Speak March, rally, appearance… 40. But because a whole bunch of people need to combat hate, and shut it down, and many more… Let’s do this on a Sunday after we’ve had our brunch, or maybe before, man. Let’s have a little punch on with the cops, that’s how they get their cardio in.
But of course, it is just a perfect example here again, Lee, where when the left has its marches, there is no countermarch, right? There is no one who stands in their way and says, look, I don’t care what you believe. I don’t care what your evidence is, no. But every single time someone on the right tries to do whatever they wish to do, in small numbers like 40, instead of just ignoring it, because if you’ve got a protest to 40 people, I guarantee you how many people are going to pay attention to it, 4/5ths [inaudible 00:04:53] bugger all, but the only reason I talk about it even existing tonight is because of the counter-protest.
This has been going on for years, but it’s really ramped up in the past few years. And I’m not suggesting that everyone leaves the house every time some lefty’s got an idea of how to stuff up somebody else’s weekend. But Lee, in terms of the fight, in terms of the debate, we’ve got to think about it like they think about it, which is every single day is not a day to put the feet up, but every single day is a day to take them on.
Lee Hanson:
Yeah, absolutely. Do you know what’s really disappointing, is the only way that they can protest or anti-protest against this is through violence and aggression. They ask for respect in return, but yet they can’t respect the free speech of the organisation or group that actually spoke up. And first of all, I just want to apologise to this group who actually had to go through this, and actually thank them for standing up and speaking up, and helping to defend our women’s rights, which have been eroded by all this wokeness and gender ideology in schools, and male in female change rooms, et cetera. Now, the fact that they had to be confronted with aggression, police officers were injured, I believe, and if it was actually anti-transgender or protesting against it, why were there signs of death to Australia?
Paul Murray:
Correct.
Lee Hanson:
So, I do not believe that it was actually, they were there for those reasons, other than pure left activists using it as a platform and a grandstand to push more division and more hatred in this country, and it’s enough. I also want to know why they were wearing masks. We need to make a stand and we have to stop this. I firmly believe that all masks should be banned at any protest, I don’t care what protest it’s for. If you show up in a mask, you are nothing but a coward. We need to put legislation in and to make a stand and give the police officers the powers to arrest them, and if you wear a mask, you will never be allowed to protest again in this country. Stop being a coward, and let people have free speech, and stop counteracting it with aggression and violence.
Paul Murray:
100%. 100%. Look, I gave in to those losers that were wearing the masks, walking in the middle of the night in Melbourne last week, I’m planning a whole thing tomorrow about the comparison, which is, had the media focused a lot on the masks when it was those people marching, but virtually no mention of the masks of the people that were marching today, I agree completely with everything that Lee just said about those who wish to hide behind the mask. Now, Daniel, again, that concept, and it’s always interesting, right? Is that if the left speaks with combative language, such as we will confront, we will take on, we will fight… This is all signs of passion.
If I or you or Lee tonight talk about fight, and all of that… Oh, the militaristic language of Steve Bannon, as they’re trying to… Automatically, yet again a way of trying to say, hey, you off the field… My point is that I don’t know what happens in three years time, electorally, I don’t know what happens with our society in five years time, but if you believe what you believe, then you should be able to realise that in any forum you can have a conversation where you will say, no, no, sorry, that’s wrong. Don’t be a dick, just sorry, I think you’re wrong.
Daniel Wild:
Well, I agree, Paul, and there’s a couple of important points there. I think the first is that why is it that it’s often the left that are the ones that take this action? And the simple answer to that is we love Australia and they hate Australia, that’s why we’re always playing Whack a Mole. We think what we basically have as a country is a good country, and we seek to defend it, and they’re seeking to change it. So, therefore, we’re always naturally going to be in a defensive posture because we’re defending something that we love. The other point you make, I think is important about getting involved. I always encourage people on my side of politics to sign up. Don’t complain about a political party not doing what you want it to do, whatever political party that might be, Labour, Liberal, Green, One Nation, whatever, don’t complain about it, but then sit on the sidelines, if you have the capacity to get involved, then I think you have a responsibility to get involved, and do what you can to make a difference.
And you’re exactly right, whatever we could do in our own capacity to make the arguments we need to make is absolutely important because Australia is basically centre-right country, by default, we are basically a centre-right country, but we lose a lot of political debates and political battles because we’re up against a very intransigent minority that doesn’t give up, and we need to adopt some of that mentality.
Paul Murray:
Again, think of how the Greens is sort of the tail wagging the dog, in terms of the polls, and in terms of party representation, that’s certainly evening up right now when it comes to One Nation. Hey, I’ve got a little bit of breaking news right now too, which is that a Volodymyr Zelenskyy is going to be meeting with Donald Trump, I believe in the White House in the next couple of days, to discuss what was being discussed with Putin a couple of days ago in Alaska. The breaking news tonight is that Keir Starmer, the prime minister of the United Kingdom, will be with him, perhaps to avoid what happened last time, they were all together in the Oval Office, or to lend him a tie, just in case he’s deciding to turn up and not wear the tie and jacket, which caused troubles last time. But interesting here, the tag team of the United Kingdom and the United States, and they’ve sort of traded blows and traded positions about which one was most interested in helping Ukraine, will be in the room to discuss peace with Ukraine in the next couple of days.
That’s the news that’s coming around as we speak. Now, Lee, looking forward to being in Tassie next week, I know there’s an awful lot of people who would like me to make an entire hour about greyhound racing, and you know how I’m a supporter of greyhound racing, but I’m happy to talk about it at another time between now and the week. But as the negotiations go on for whether there is or isn’t this vote of no confidence in the next couple of days, we saw the greyhound industry who were promised by the Libs a couple of days before the election, no, no, we’re all in on you, a couple of weeks after the election, under the bus. Why? Because they need those, and they are super lefty.
Oh, the guy with the beard, super lefty, those independents that are now going to be trying to run everything from the south of the state, which I know how much that loves all the people in the north. Remember Tasmania, if you don’t know, is a beautiful place that has separate public holidays for the north and south of the state. Okay? It all ain’t one place, it’s very different. No Regatta Day up north. All right, now let’s talk here though, where the latest thing is about this-
Lee Hanson:
And different beer on the north or south too.
Paul Murray:
Correct. [inaudible 00:11:28] up here, boats. I get it. I get it. Now, let’s talk here though, Lee, where the latest thing is the salmon fishing stuff, where the Greenie position is bugger it all, get rid of it all, the common sense position, which is the majority position, which is, hey, it needs to exist, and by that, like any industry, it’s allowed to grow. Tonight, the negotiations apparently with the government and the bearded ones are saying, well, maybe just no more, or we might have a review to make sure that there’ll be no more, is salmon about to go the way of the greyhounds?
Lee Hanson:
Look, firstly, this is just an indicator that unfortunately Rockliff is bending at the knee, because he wants to stay in power with the independents, and wooing the Greens to hopefully get the majority of power. Firstly, I just want to say that it’s disappointing for the Liberals who voted for him, or the voters who voted for, prior to the election, he’s now doing a back flip basically on everything that they stood by, the values of the party that they thought they were voting for. So, I feel sorry for them, I really do, that’s not what they voted in for. But then we look at the salmon industry, I know it’s a very contentious issue down here in Tasmania. My deepest concern is that they will throw the baby out with the bath water, and drop the salmon industry, which is going to have a devastating effect.
So, you’ve got the greyhounds, you have going, you’ve got backing out of the forestry deal, 40,000 hectares down here, backing out of the forestry deal, and now you’ve got the salmon. So, how many jobs are potentially on the line? The livelihoods, the rural communities, the remote communities. Now, I do agree that there needs to be some time and effort put into the salmon industry to bridge the gap, understand the myths, and bust the myths, and also help the communities involved. So, whilst he’s saying he wants an independent review and no further expansion on the salmon farming until then, I just hope, I really hope that it is a genuine, independent review, with the aim to fix the issues, if there are any issues, and work with the community to create a viable industry moving forward. I hope this independent review isn’t just a mask or a charade to shut down the industry because then we’re going to be in a lot of pain down here.
Paul Murray:
Yeah. Look, again, I understand why at this moment in time, where everyone’s worried about what’s going to happen next week, there has to be a line in the sand about what you’re willing not to trade away, I know the answer is the Tassie Devils in the stadium, but, but, but. You may have just had an election, but there’ll be another one, there’s always another one down the track, and whatever is being traded now is going to be used against them. And also, I’m sorry, those lefty independents, they might back you on Tuesday, and then they’ll slit your throat on Thursday. All right? In my view, what they’re trying to do is try to take a whole bunch of things that one half of Tasmania would naturally defend, take them all slowly off the table, so they slit the throat of that government and any opposition to them going ahead and doing what they were always planning to do anyway on the left suddenly evaporates.
Hence what happened with the greyhounds, as an example. Which is if no one’s fighting for them, then no one cares, that’s the, to be honest, [inaudible 00:14:48], tiddly winks, for those who may remember that game from a long time ago, or at least it was there when my gran made me play it. Now, Dan, give me an idea here, Daniel, about a bold prediction for the week ahead, my friend, what is definitely happening, what do I write down here, and then send to the Governor-General, who will of course Instagram about it, after we’re welcome to country, but it will become Gazetted law.
Daniel Wild:
Well, I’m feeling good because I’m one for one after my prediction last week that the crows would get up, so-
Paul Murray:
Yeah, that’s right. [inaudible 00:15:15].
Daniel Wild:
I’ll boldly make another prediction. I’ll make another prediction that the productivity summit that we’re all eagerly awaiting, that will be held in the Great Hall at Parliament House in Canberra, will come up with precisely zero that will increase productivity. So, anyone who’s going to that, I hope the scones and jam and tea and coffee are good, because that’s all they’re going to get out of it.
Paul Murray:
Yep, you are about as important as a seat filler at the Logies. All right? Lee, a bold prediction from you, my friend.
Lee Hanson:
Dan, I agree with you with the productivity commission for starters, but I do think it’ll be a segue to tax increases, so we won’t get donuts, we will get tax increases. My bold prediction for this week is, I wonder if the stadium in Tasmania might become the next bend at the knee issue to hit the discussion tables, to potentially woo the Greens, to get the majority of power down here-
Paul Murray:
To get through one vote, one vote, of which they will screw them over on. Anyway, this time next week, we get to see you face to face, mate, looking forward to it and seeing everyone else in Hobart. Daniel, look forward to seeing you too.
This transcript of Daniel Wild on Paul Murray Live – Sky News Australia from 17 August 2025 has been edited for clarity.
