In this interview, Adam Creighton on The Power Hour – Sky News Australia contextualises and disseminates the findings of the IPA’s research into the government’s covid-19 response.
All media appearances posted onto the IPA website are directly related to the promotion and dissemination of IPA research
Gabriella Power:
Joining us now is chief economist at the Institute of Public Affairs, Adam Creighton. Adam, thank you so much for joining us once again. Robert De Niro, I mean, he’s had Trump derangement syndrome for some time now, but isn’t it ironic to hear him on MSNBC of all places to say that the American people who don’t watch the mainstream media are certainly not getting the truth?
Adam Creighton:
No, it’s just extraordinary. I mean, that station, MSNBC, has really been the biggest purveyor of misinformation, I would say, of all the networks in the US. There’s the Russiagate scandal, the Hunter Biden laptop was Russian disinformation. There was Trump said that Nazis are very fine people.
There are so many examples of this. And it’s also a very insulting comment to ordinary Americans who can make up their own minds. I mean, one of the glories now of the media landscape is that there is so much choice and people can fact check various claims. There are podcasts, there are newspapers online, there’s of course, cable.
So look, I just think he’s very bitter that the Trump presidency at the moment has had quite a few wins in recent weeks, and I think there’s a lot of anger about that. Actually, there was a movie, I think in the late 1990s that De Niro was in called Analyse This. And I think he played a criminal who had to see a psychiatrist to get a better understanding of the world. Well, maybe this is a chance for art to finally imitate life, imitate art rather.
Gabriella Power:
Yes, I think so. You look on MSNBC’s web page, I visit it constantly. And you barely see the President getting any recognition. I mean, they moved on from his significant achievement ending the war in Gaza-
Adam Creighton:
It’s pure propaganda, it really is.
Gabriella Power:
… in a matter of days. Correct. It absolutely is. And as you say, De Niro’s comments are pretty insulting to the American people. They can absolutely make up their own mind and get the truth absolutely anywhere else, apart from MSNBC and CNN.
Adam Creighton:
Totally.
Gabriella Power:
Adam, finally, after tonight… Oh, sorry. No, you go.
Adam Creighton:
No, I was just going to say the left’s always criticising Fox News, but I honestly think MSNBC makes Fox News look like the BBC in 1965. I mean, it’s so far left and extreme that, I mean, it’s a comedic statement of De Niro. Sorry for-
Gabriella Power:
No, no, I couldn’t agree more, but I’m eager to talk to you about this meeting that’s finally taken place after nine long months. Australia’s prime minister, Anthony Albanese, has finally met with Donald Trump at the White House. And just the fact that it has taken nine months is not a joke, when you consider how much the president gets done every single day. And it’s taken more than 270 days for the President to make time for Anthony Albanese.
And you look at what he has done in that time. I mean, Donald Trump has had one-on-one meetings with leaders of Israel, Argentina, India, South Africa, Ukraine, Russia, the UK, France. I mean, it goes on and on. He’s met with more than 20 world leaders. It is only now that we are approaching the one-year mark of Trump 2.0 that this meeting has finally taken place.
So certainly shows you where we stand with the United States, which I think of course, makes sense when you look at how Anthony Albanese is running Australia. But today, of course, the two leaders signed a major 8.5 US I should say billion dollar rare earths and critical minerals deal. And the President also showed his support for the AUKUS submarine deal insisting that it is moving along rapidly. But it was, of course, this question by Sky News political editor, Andrew Clennell, that is getting headlines right around the world with the president blasting Australia’s ambassador to the US, Kevin Rudd.
Donald Trump:
I don’t know anything about him. I mean if you said bad, then maybe he’ll like to apologise. I really don’t know. Did an ambassador say something about him? Don’t tell me. Where is he? Is he still working for you?
Kevin Rudd:
Yeah, yeah.
Donald Trump:
You said bad?
Kevin Rudd:
Before I took this position, Mr. President-
Donald Trump:
I don’t like you either. And i probably never will.
Gabriella Power:
Adam, can I please get your reaction?
Adam Creighton:
Well, look, I mean, I think actually the President was very gracious, I think to Kevin Rudd. It could have gone a lot worse than that. I think Trump showed himself to be a great statesman there, really. I mean the things that Rudd said were really nasty, the most destructive president in US history and various other things like that.
I mean, I think actually that Rudd got off pretty well from that exchange. But I should add that I really think Rudd should step aside from that position. I think this has put the Australian government, I think in a very awkward position because of course, they can’t sack Rudd now it looks like we’re servile to the United States then. But of course, Rudd, he can find another job. He’s got extensive contacts. I’m sure there’s plenty of jobs in the UN that he could take and he hasn’t taken them, which I think it’s bad for Australia because I know-
Gabriella Power:
Of course it is.
Adam Creighton:
… Trump kind of played it down there. But it is embarrassing that you have one of the best allies of the United States and the ambassador says, “Trump is the most destructive president in US history.” I mean, that’s not really tenable in my books.
Gabriella Power:
No, he’s called Donald Trump a village idiot. He’s made other comments saying he’s a traitor to the west. And then Kevin Rudd had to chase down Donald Trump and then offer this apology after Donald Trump suggested that maybe he should apologise for those comments. But I agree with you. I don’t think it really helps Australia and our relationship with the United States.
I mean, the fact that it has taken this long to finally get this meeting. And now the headlines around the world is that Donald Trump has blasted Kevin Rudd. But Adam, what do you make of how the relationship will go between Australia and the US from here? I suppose what the two leaders were able to achieve today was significant, signing a major rare earths deal to, of course, counter China’s dominance. And now rare earth stocks have certainly jumped. And the president also showed his support for August, AUKUS rather. Let’s just take a listen.
Donald Trump:
It was made a while ago and nobody did anything about it. And it was going too slowly. We do actually have a lot of submarines. We have the best submarines in the world, anywhere in the world. And we’re building a few more currently under construction. And now we’re starting, we have it all set with Anthony. We’ve worked on this long and hard, and we’re starting that process right now. And I think it’s really moving along very rapidly. Very well.
Gabriella Power:
Adam, what’s your assessment of the rest of the meeting?
Adam Creighton:
Well, look, I think it was a win for Albanese. I think it was a win for Australia. It could have gone a lot worse, actually. I mean, there’s so many points of foreign policy disagreement and domestic policy disagreement that Trump could have brought up, but he really didn’t.
And not only did he not do that, he said AUKUS is going ahead and the subs are going ahead, the rare earths deal. I mean, certainly Albanese would’ve been very scared, I think, on the way over, because as you said earlier in the programme, nine months or something like that, between where there wasn’t a meeting. And that was indeed very embarrassing.
But Trump, again, just like I said before, he’s quite gracious and diplomatic when he wants to be. And I think probably people were in his ear before the meeting, I would say from the State Department saying, “Australia’s very important. Australia’s very important.” And so he was nice. And he even said that our defence spending was kind of okay. So look, I mean I think the appearance of it, the Labour government will certainly take that as a win.
Gabriella Power:
Yeah, absolutely. Let’s talk about what’s happening in Victoria. I mean, what a mess it is. Two Victorian police officers had to be hospitalised over the weekend after left wing activists attacked officers during protests in Melbourne. Let’s listen to Victoria Police.
Wayne Cheeseman:
The people that came to pick the fight with police were the issue motivated groups on the left. I can tell you that the March for Australia group, they were peaceful. They were engaging. They listened to our instructions, they did what they were told, and they protested by example. The disruption to Melbourne, to the general public who want to come into our fine city, the disruption to businesses. We really need to find an answer of what we do.
Gabriella Power:
So Adam, police making it very clear who’s causing trouble here. Left wing activists, far left wing activists. Yet that seemed to have been missed by many of our mainstream media outlets.
Adam Creighton:
Certainly. No, look, certainly that’s true. After the march on Sunday, I went to The Age to read what had happened. And I read an article. And it sounded like from the article that it was all a March for Australia people that were doing terrible things. And then later on in the day, I saw that clip. And I thought, “Hang on. What? That’s the complete opposite of what was reported basically, or certainly what was implied.”
So it’s good that the police were calling out the truth. And my experience is at least that the left wing protests are extremely vicious and violent. In fact, a few months ago when I first arrived in Melbourne, I found myself caught up in a trans rights protest on Burke Street. Not, I wasn’t willingly there, but I was there and I saw the way they treated the police. And it was unbelievably bad, spitting on them, screaming at them. I was really shocked.
So it’s good that the police have said that. And maybe that goes some way to restoring the public’s respect for the Victorian police, because of course, since COVID, their reputation has declined somewhat. But most of the March for Australia people I think were very peaceful from what I hear. And yet on the other side, there were burnings of Australian flags and so forth. Very disappointing.
Gabriella Power:
And it’s refreshing to hear the truth from the police there, making that really important point that most of the people who turned out for the March for Australia rally were peaceful. And look, Adam, I’ve been in similar situations as you, when I’ve spent plenty of years in Melbourne reporting and covering protests. I’ve seen some very far left-wing activists be very aggressive.
Adam Creighton:
Yeah.
Gabriella Power:
And it’s really not a pleasant experience at all.
Adam Creighton:
Yeah, just a broader point on Victoria, it’s really sad. The press Victoria has been getting recently is just absolutely shocking, whether it’s crime or economics. And I just can’t believe that the state government here doesn’t realise how bad it is for their citizens. I mean, people are moving away, house prices are falling. It’s very sad, not just for Victoria, but also for Australia too.
Gabriella Power:
It is.
Adam Creighton:
So I really think the Labour government down there is a black mark on the country at the moment. But anyway, maybe that was-
Gabriella Power:
No, I agree with you. And Premier Jacinta Allan must be divorced from reality. I mean, she’s insisting that the city is safe as Melbourne’s right in the middle of this horrific crime wave, Adam.
Adam Creighton:
Yeah, that’s true. Indeed, some crime statistics came out recently, at least on the burglary and the carjacking front. The absolute numbers are actually double in Victoria from New South Wales, which is extraordinary because the population of course, in New South Wales is about 20, 30% higher, but there are actually more crimes down there.
And I think part of the reason, I think is the rate of incarceration in Victoria is just so low. I think the rate there from memory, the IPA did some research on this recently, and Victoria has the lowest rate of incarceration in the country, 104, I think per 100,000. And in New South Wales, 194, and I think in Western Australia, 200 and something.
So if you’re not putting criminals in jail, well of course there’s going to be more crime on the streets. And the Andrews government, the Allan government, they’ve changed the laws, I think repeatedly in the last five years to basically make it harder for the judiciary to put people in prison.
Gabriella Power:
That’s exactly right. And I think if you look at what’s happening now, also is partly the result of Daniel Andrews putting Melbourne and Victoria through one of the world’s longest lockdowns.
Adam Creighton:
Absolutely.
Gabriella Power:
And I mean-
Adam Creighton:
Absolutely.
Gabriella Power:
… it’s horrific for so many citizens of it. I think it’s very frustrating for everyone Australia, not even people in Melbourne, to hear from Premier Jacinta Allan saying that the city is safe, when any day now that you turn on the news, there’s another machete attack. And so she’s just gaslighting Victorians. But Adam Creighton, thank you so much for joining us. Brilliant to speak with you.
Adam Creighton:
Thanks very much.
This transcript with Adam Creighton on The Power Hour Sky News Australia has been edited for clarity.
