In this interview, Adam Creighton appeared on Sharri – Sky News Australia to discuss the IPA’s research on housing.
All media appearances posted onto the IPA website are directly related to the promotion and dissemination of IPA research.
Below is a transcript of the interview.
Danica De Giorgio:
Joining us now for more on today’s top stories is National Senator Matt Canavan and Senior Fellow and Chief Economist at the Institute of Public Affairs Adam Creighton. Hi to both of you. Thank you so much for joining me. I want to begin with the warm and fluffy panda diplomacy and just a reminder to both of you of how much this Prime Minister loves a picture opportunity with pandas. This is what he said.
Anthony Albanese:
Those pictures go to 27 million people potentially in Australia. They go to over a billion people in China, a billion people.
Danica De Giorgio:
Matt, it’s all about pictures. What’s the Prime Minister actually achieved during this trip?
Matt Canavan:
Well, look, it seems like he’s had a really good holiday. His honeymoon with his fiancee should happen after the wedding, not before. And I mean, how long has this guy been out of the country for? It’s been a whole week. Sure, it’s important to go and talk to other countries. Sure, it’s even appropriate to have some photo op with a Panda at the Great Wall or something, but I don’t think you need six days to do that, six days. Look at all the issues that are facing this country. The young people can’t afford a home. I’ve spent my week trying to fight for the 6,000 jobs in our smelters and refineries that are on the chopping block. Ironically, partly thanks to the aggressive industrial tactics of the Chinese government, which I didn’t hear the Prime Minister say a single word about on his trip.
And so those 6,000 jobs, a lot of them are union jobs. These are jobs in smelters and refineries. They’re good high paying union jobs. They’re on the chopping block right now because the Chinese government has financed a massive expansion of nickel smelting, of copper refining, of all of these critical minerals. And they’re doing so in ways that aren’t consistent with international trade rules. And the Prime Minister has not spent any time standing up for those workers, for Australian workers, and instead has spent his time getting happy snaps around various Chinese tourist sites. I mean, this guy’s not paid to do that. He’s paid to protect Australians and Australian jobs, and he’s failing at that right now.
Danica De Giorgio:
Oh, look, absolutely, and I couldn’t help but notice, Adam, how the Prime Minister is throwing his support behind the Australian Open’s 2026 Wild Card tournament in Chengdu, and it comes amid ongoing concerns regarding the fate of former Chinese player Peng Shui who vanished years ago after she accused the retired Communist Party officials of sexual assault, Adam. But Albo had nothing to say about that yet he’s out on the tennis courts as, I don’t know if he’s the CEO of Tourism Australia, the CEO of Kon-Tiki. I’m not sure what he was doing on this trip.
Adam Creighton:
Well, look, he should have realised that when he talks about the tennis, that obviously journalists will refer to the Chinese tennis player who disappeared. It’s just another reminder of the different philosophical systems of our two countries and that we are focusing so much energy on this totalitarian dictatorship. That’s what China is. And as Matt said, he was there six days. The timing could not have been worse really. They’ve got the U.S. is currently conducting a review of the AUKUS Treaty. They want to see Australia as very much on their side, and here’s our Prime Minister spending six days there and talking about the tennis and getting photos with pandas. The length of the trip was unnecessary, I think, and the timing was terrible, and it’s really achieved nothing except I think basically offend the U.S. at a critical time.
Danica De Giorgio:
Absolutely. I just think the optics of it are just shocking right now. Now, let’s move on because miners have warned Labour of potential plant closures, inflation, and an expensive transition to net-zero as the industry faces a likely shortfall of carbon credits in five years. Rio Tinto says that the shortfall would put significant pressure on market and price dynamics. Matt, you were just talking there about the industry. What do you make of this?
Matt Canavan:
Well, this is the other threat, the long-term threat to major manufacturing facilities in Australia. As I say, there’s a short-term issue with the way the market’s being flooded by Chinese products. In the long-term, you’ve got the Australian government putting on a carbon tax on all of these facilities right now through what they call the safeguard mechanism. That mechanism requires them to buy carbon credits every year, 5% of their carbon emissions every year has to be reduced, and they have to increase the amount of carbon credits they’re buying every year. What Rio Tinto is saying here is, like that what most people that look at this market, this carbon credit market say, is that the price of carbon credits are going to go through the roof as more carbon emission reductions have to occur over the next decade or so.
At the moment, at current carbon prices, these facilities, these factories are up for a $6.6 billion bill to decarbonize to 2050 to get to net-zero. If the price doubles or more, which many people think it will, obviously, that bill goes to 12, to 15, possibly 20 billion. Meanwhile, the federal government already has $10 billion of assistance to these factories who are struggling with their costs. So we’re going to tax them on this hand, we’re going to put a tax on them, and then we’re going to come along and give taxpayers dollars, which we’ve taxed you at home, and we’re going to give them that money back to pay the tax, to pay the carbon tax. Why don’t we just cut out the middle then and get rid of the carbon tax? It makes no sense. It’s doing nothing for the environment. It’s just putting Australian jobs at risk.
Danica De Giorgio:
Oh, look, absolutely. I can’t even believe it’s even being discussed right now. It’s extraordinary. Now, Adam, I alluded to this earlier on, I want to talk about housing targets and migration. The CEO of Master Builders Australia has told Sky News private markets believe it’s too costly to build in Australia in a further blow to this 1.2 million homes target by 2029, which we know that Labour is not going to achieve now. I mean, that’s according to leaked Treasury documents. Adam, the IPA has done really good research about migration. I mentioned that one earlier, but where are we going to put all of these people? We don’t have enough homes as it is. Labor’s not going to reach its housing accord targets. What are we going to do?
Adam Creighton:
Well, look, you are certainly right to point out those figures. Governments are basically hopeless at boosting housing supply. Of course, there was a famous example from New Zealand a few years ago when Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern promised 100,000 houses, and I think they ended up building about 250. The similar situation, not quite as bad, is happening here where the government is already 55,000, 60,000 homes behind schedule in just the first year. There is no way that it’s going to reach that 1.2 million. The Treasury itself in that so-called leaked document said the same thing. So it is just outrageous that we’re bringing in so many people to this country. It’s almost as if the government is trying to sabotage the living standards of people who live here, and that’s a strong thing to say. But those figures are so outrageous.
In the first 11 months of the financial year just gone, net overseas migration is 90,000 more than was forecast in the budget. It was forecast, I think you said 335. Well, it’s 90,000 more than that already, and we don’t even have the June figures. So I mean, to me that is reckless and outrageous and we have all this focus on productivity round table and tax, whether we should broaden the GST. These arguments are important, but in my view, they actually pale in comparison to this immigration issue at the moment, which is reducing our standard of living very dramatically. And also I would argue it’s undermining social cohesion I would say as well. So it’s a serious problem and it needs to be addressed.
Danica De Giorgio:
Oh, look, I completely agree with you. There’s so many different factors to this. And, Matt, Master Builders, they’ve been warning for a long time that Labour will not meet its housing targets. And now we see this “leaked”, and I put leaked in inverted commas there, this document that was released earlier this week. But I mean, the question has to be asked, what are we going to do? We’ve got so many people coming into this country, where are we going to put them?
Matt Canavan:
Well, what Adam said is absolutely right. It’s been clear the government’s not going to meet its housing commitment for some time. You could cut them some slack in the sense that a lot of the drivers that can influence the number of housing starts that occur at any one year are at the state government level, at the local government level, those issues. But what the federal government can control, directly control is the number of people entering this country. They issue the visas. They issue permanent residency. They can control that. And surely the number of people coming to this country should be calibrated to the number of houses that are available to put a roof over their head.
We cannot and should not be bringing in way more people than we have houses to keep people sheltered. And that’s what we’ve been doing now for the first three years of the Albanese government by a large margin. Just do the math. They’re building 180,000 homes a year. We’re bringing in, as Adam said, about over 400,000. We were at 500,000. We’re now over 400,000 bringing in a 12-month period. Do the math. That doesn’t add up. We do not have enough houses. We should be waiting to make sure all Australians have a roof over their head before we bring in more people from overseas.
Danica De Giorgio:
Absolutely. I think it’s very simple.
Adam Creighton:
It’s pointing out, too, [inaudible 00:09:15], just very briefly. Sorry, just very briefly on the time it takes to build a house. I mean, it was basically flat lined at eight months for many, many years, and now it is 12 months. Just in the last few years, it’s gone up to 12 months to build a house. So that’s red tape, green tape. I mean, that is also just as outrageous as the immigration. Just worth pointing out.
Danica De Giorgio:
Yeah, that figure in itself is just extraordinary. Yeah, we’ve got a real problem in this country. Adam Creighton, Matt Canavan, good to see you both. Thanks very much for joining me on the show this evening.
This transcript with Adam Creighton talking on Sharri – Sky News Australia from 17 July 2025 has been edited for clarity.
